Wednesday, April 23, 2008

LULZ Courtesy of The Online Radical Feminist Posse

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Here are some quotes that have surfaced over the past few weeks that are sure to generate many, many laughs. I swear, I could write for hours about the white privilege, class privilege, bigotry, and illogical conclusions contained in each one of these comments. Feel free to add any more that you've read lately. It's Hump day, which always brings out the most evol of all my porny, sex-positive, sarcastic inclinations. So, enjoy the butthurt --or not. I don't particularly care because I'm laughing which is all that matters right about now.

Butthurt Radical Feminists=Epic Lulz

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Heart aka CrunchyGranolaDyke aka Cheryl Lindsey Seelhoff

who brags about receiving millions of dollars in a lawsuit a few years ago but still hits up her readers for money every couple of months. She's also the same person who pretended to be a lesbian on the Michigan Women's Music Festival forums until it was discovered that she's been married to the father of her two youngest kids for close to a decade now.
"I would not expect any committed, woman-centered, feminist with an established internet presence to make herself available for debates with others on the internet who have demonstrated that they are willing to play fast and loose with the truth, who lie outright, who are malicious and hateful, who seem unstable or unbalanced, or who have dedicated themselves to harming the reputations, credibility or lives of committed feminist women."

"I’m moderating this thread strictly and won’t allow it to be pissed upon in any way, shape or form. At RE’s the male pornhounds — including a fairly scary hardcore sm pornographer — are there full force; some of the threads about this over there are about 90 percent men."
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Samantha Berg

the self-proclaimed "radical feminist" who ditched her appearance at Monday's William & Mary debate about sex work because Jill Brenneman and Renegade Evolution (an actual sex worker) was going to be on the panel. That sort of chicanery simply can't be allowed, I guess. And why, oh why, is it whenever these white "radical feminists" want to bolster their claims, they have to try to prove just how hip and cool they are by mentioning how much black people love them?
"The trash talk began within hours of being surreptitiously offered the spot on the panel, and that sort of smug pugnaciousness and disrespectful engagement was instrumental in prompting John to cancel his appearance on the panel and he suggested to me that I do the same. I believe we were right to cancel. I refuse to pose for the pornographically spiteful scene being painted."
"Little story: Heading home from presenting at a prostitution conference I was in the airport shuttle with a middle-aged black social worker with her name tag still pinned to her blouse. I’m a young, white, tattoo-bearing woman and at the time I think my hair was blue. We exchanged delicate pleasantries and danced around how we talked about the conference until she sat up earnestly and cut to the chase, “So, are you for or against?” When I replied, “Against,” she slouched down and sighed and we grooved on the same anti-prostitution track until we got to the airport."
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rmott62

who's apparently very concerned about the kind of consensual sex that other folks are having.
"The constant attacks made on radical feminists for daring to say that the sex is highly damaging is scary. This is not a false fear. The mental abuse done by these attacks has silenced radical feminist bloggers."
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Pisaquari classics

Clearly the debate's organizers should have realized what sweet little delicate flowers these radical feminists are and been more focused on making sure they didn't have to deal with actually debating anyone at the debate. I have one question though. Just how do they manage not to crumble in the wind as they step outside of their door each day? I mean, if hearing about other people's lives renders her completely incapable of speaking freely, how does she survive morning traffic jams? For that matter, how would she survive walking down the street with all those non-radical non-feminist people that she'd surely encounter along the way? My advice would be that if being around people whose experiences contradict your theories makes you this upset, it might be best to stay at home in bed with the covers over your head.
"Sam would have been at the organizer’s mercy for how the debate was orchestrated and thus should have had her situation as a radical feminist, as well as someone making extra sacrifices (i.e. distance traveled, feeling indebted to friends lending financial resources), waaaay better considered and respected."
"I am not comfortable being my radical feminist self amongst transpersons. Reading transperson accounts online and in books does not help it either–in fact, it heightens my inability to speak freely. How can I, a gender abolitionist, feel comfortable speaking out against gender and its manifestations in the company of a transperson? How can I, a gender abolitionist, feel comfortable talking about my frustrations and hardships with the idea that what our bodies are born has anything to do with how we should express ourselves, in the company of a transperson?"
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Satsuma

whose screeds decrying the evil that is heterosexuality recently led to a big catfight on Heart's blog. Ironically, this time she also manages to proclaim gay men as teh enemy, too. Her claim about gay men and mass murder--that's just stupid, by the way. It is a bit surprising (not!) that this liberated, radical lesbian would have such a Victorian obsession with how proper ladies and gentlemen are supposed to behave. I guess it's just a coincidence that her moral code is based entirely around white, Western mores.

"Our culture, and by this I mean womanist culture, or feminist spaces or whatever, have become very vulgar. I’ve noticed how vulgar language has become in the U.S. Language itself is filled with “pornified” words, and drug referenced words."

"Young women think it’s hip and cool to be so vulgar that I just had to quit leading lesbian drop-in groups entirely, for the first time in about 25 years."

"You wouldn’t believe the sleaze that gay men buy into either, so men do this to other men, not just women. Gay men engaged in consensual mass murder “the AIDS epidemic” and could care less about the results. Their entire urban culture have become one vulgar sexual scene."

"Pornography has always horrified me. Sexual excess and the degradation of women horrified me. Heck, women with make-up pastered on their faces with breast implants horrify me."
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Lara

This comment was regarding her feelings about the Sex Workers' Art Show that she attended. One might wonder why someone who went to a performance with that name would expect for the artists to represent the views of people who have only discussed sex work instead of actually experiencing it.
"What an insult to radical feminists who have worked really damned hard doing research and discussing with thought and seriousness the effects sex working has on women, men, and society as a whole."
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Laurelin


In a multi-blog discussion about whether it's appropriate for bloggers to decide for themselves whether or not to allow my fellow Louisianian blogger, Anthony Kennerson, to comment on feminist issues, she had this stuff to say. I found the first quote really funny because if you substitute "male entitlement" with "the attitudes of privileged white women" it describes that entire thread and those who posted on it to the letter. The second quote shows just how deeply entrenched her sense of privilege really is. If you disagree with her, then you clearly have no right to speak. Am I the only one who sees nothing new about a room full of white women complaining about an uppity person of color who dares to think that they have a right to free speech and reiterating how appalled they are by the fact that some of their fellow white women simply don't see things the same way? Anthony, how dare you make fun of these porcelain goddesses! Why, don't you know that the idea of a big black buck daring to comment on their affairs is just more than they can bear?
"Male entitlement is amazing to me. I’m always surprised by how far it goes, and literally how much such chaps think is owed them, how we should all listen to their dumbass opinion."
"They know they have no right to say what they are saying. Don’t expect them to listen to feminist thought; they will shout us down at every opportunity, while claiming the friendship of those of whom they approve. Watch how they shout down women on their blogs who do not fit their image of sexy, agreeable, polite. Pro-feminists, if they are to be worthy of the name, have to listen to things they may find upsetting. They must accept criticism from feminists, listen to all women’s truths, no matter how inconvienient for their desires and masculinities."
"pretending you find radical feminists’ arguments ‘funny’ in order to show your contempt is just as nasty as calling us all bitches, or whatever. if you can’t be civil, shut your mouth."
"Another thing: RK is joining in on a thread on a pro-porn blog which is basically making fun of our concerns here- with several of the more infamous cowardly pornsick liberal males."
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Maggie Hays

Hey Maggie, we're on ur blogz, stealin' ur quotes! Maybe she should find out how many of her fellow rad fems ask for "copyright permissions" before they paste a quote on their blogs.

We haven’t ever done nothing to this guy and his pro-porny friends apart from being anti-porn radfems, which seem to be enough for this pro-porner and his friends to steal too large quotes from our posts without even asking for copyright permissions, stalking us online and stupidly trash us on their blogs.

16 comments:

Anthony Kennerson said...

Oh, WOW.....I, feel, like, soooo popular.

It's so amazing that little old me, not even a L-list blogger, whose blog would probably not even tilt the Technocrati scales, is causing so much discombubulation in so many of the GenderBorg Collective.

And I don't even get a red cent from any porn mag, speaker's honoraria, even.

Yeah...I'm such a threat to them. And I plan on continuing right on, too. They done pissed me off.

BTW....nice takedown yourserf, Bint...and here's hoping your wisdom tooth surgery went well.


Anthony
(Just call me "SmackDog Pornsturbator")

missnomered said...

/facepalm.

Oh my god... the amount of stupid is simply overwhelming. And the fact that so many of them sound like Falwell-esque fundie types...well, it's just plain scary. (You know, how "vulgar" kids today are.)

I linked a couple of them in a recent blog post as to why people like them FAIL... and I will, personally, laugh my ass off if one of them writes an angry blog response. Because it will give my new lil' blog a lot of publicity. *evil grin*

Lisa Harney said...

I got their attention recently, and had some incredibly stupid comments (one radical feminist commenter calling intersectionality an "academic theory" and thus dismissing it out of hand, another insisting that Heart respects all trans women and would never say anything bad about them).

Somewhere, I have a file of Satsuma's eyerollers about trans women, but I lost the links and wordpress lost the post. I do like her constant insistence that the lesbian community doesn't really get into sex much and that it's trans women lesbians who bring their pornified male minds and sex into lesbian spaces.

Plus her elaborate and violent revenge porn about men, trans women, and straight women.

It's like Wolfgang Pauli said, "That's not right. That's not even wrong."

belledame222 said...

It's quite the performance, isn't it?
and "crumble" nothing, I don't understand how some of these people have gotten through life without, like, choking to death on their own toenails (***NO THAT WAS NOT A THREAT, PLEASE DON'T SIC YR INTERNETZ LAWYERS ON ME KTHXBAI***)

and this:

ver your head.

"Sam would have been at the organizer’s mercy for how the debate was orchestrated and thus should have had her situation as a radical feminist, as well as someone making extra sacrifices (i.e. distance traveled, feeling indebted to friends lending financial resources), waaaay better considered and respected."


it's amazing to me how many of this lot seem to be under the impression that "radical feminism" is simultaneously a strong, powerful, unstoppable force to Change The World, indeed the -only- one; and at the same time, in need of special protection, as are its standard-bearers, at all times.

one is tempted to invoke the "c" word, again. one refrains, for the moment. one adjusts one's binoculars, and waits for the next act.

belledame222 said...

and yeah, Laurelin in particular is...yeah.

I love genteel radicalism, I really do. "Take Back the Night" yelling at strip clubs and chanting slogans while flanked by Officer Friendly on all sides, then go home, put the kettle on, and click tongues about the terrible vulgar scary dirty people who're -ruining- the revolutionary tea party.

Lethal said...

I don't know if I can read all those posts, but it sure as hell looks like one fuck of a trainwreck! Just trying to increase your cursing quota. Love..

Alma Cork said...

hi :)

i came here after following a link at QT and, well, being new to this i'm continuously amazed at what a clusterfuck these people present. especially in light of the recent RenEv and BFP issues. still, this post is very funny and, damn, i needed it :)

i love the quote where it's admitted that transpeople make the person in question uncomfortable. like, awwwwwww. how does the poor darling cope.

xx

Renegade Evolution said...

Bint- thanks for the epic lolz!

RainSong said...

Thank you for this Bint.

I'm rather wondering how Pisaquari makes it down the street daily with all the strawmen she creates.

I've seen a couple of her discussions and she seems to act on her assumptions without reality checking them, and argues aginst her discussions.

I have yet to see her offer any real radical analysis. She works hard in her posts but even so, there's not a lot of radical feminism there beyond what she says it us. Perhaps, that's a form of George Bush Radical feminism that I don't know much about?

Plain(s)feminist said...

Great post, Bint!

bint alshamsa said...

Rainsong,

I agree, I also don't see much of what I would consider a radical analysis in Pisaquari's writing. Perhaps these folks would benefit from the presence of another real radical feminist in the blogosphere.

*cough*YOU*cough*

I miss your reading your views.

RainSong said...

Bint,

I have to admit that I really miss interacting with you. Cicely has pointed out that I quite capable of disagreeing and yet having a warm interaction.

Just for clarity, I couldn't tell where the intended humor of the coughs was pointed.

I am a radical feminist and I can support what I say in my analyses in literature, central to radical feminism and will anytime I asked.

A couple of other comments. Heart and I have debated over the years, we've had drawn a lot but she has never bested me. I say this while disliking the model and huierarchicalization in what I saying. In fact in some of the debates, Heart has had about ten radical feminists back in her hidden boards consulting with her in our debates and for the most part, the debates have always been friendly.

So if you were 'funnin' me, I'll understand. You have every right to do so. But even Heart has called me a 'kick ass radical feminist' many times. (I don't like that phrasing either.)

But what is true, I really do miss interacting with you. Re: the "radical feminists", around. MOST of the so called radical feminists on the net are not radical at all and I can take that back all the way to the orginal writings in Radical Feminism in 1969. Radical feminism is getting a black eye from all the widdle possees running (can you hear the the rumble of galloping hoofs in the background.)

If you think I'm radical feminist, "enough" I'd be happy to share at times. The reason I say that the possees are not radical, is that radical feminism was predicated on a class analysis and as such was totally non-essentialistic. If you hear a feminist and she is saying anything essentialistic, she is not radical - period. And is she is not employing a gendered class analysis she is not radical.

***GASP**** the shock of it all. I can hear the rattle of crunchy granola!!!!

But I can **cough** talk about **cough** radical feminism ad-infinitum because it is my passion.

Again.... the best news I've had in news is that you are allright!!!! I was sooooo elated.

bint alshamsa said...

Rainsong,

The "cough" thing was just my way of hinting that I'd really be pleased if you did add your radical feminist views to the blogosphere. I didn't want to say that you should share your views because perhaps you don't want to or don't feel that this is the right medium for you to use at this time. However, I do enjoy it whenever you contribute to any conversation that I have the opportunity to be a part of.

Yeah, Heart's boards are pretty well known. On the MWMF forum, I've seen several of the women there pretending to be "in the know" about my life based on what they've read on Heart's boards. It's really comical when you think about it. To say that they so vehemently disagree with me and prefer to resort to ablism as the default response to what I have to say, it's pretty weird that they'd feel the need to spend any of their time off of the Mich-fest board talking about me instead of building a community around whatever religio-political viewpoint it is they are currently proclaiming.

To me, you are a REAL radical feminist. I have a distinct dislike for those who have tried to use trashing tactics to discourage any one from examining the content of your arguments. If what you write is examined, I think that it can be critiqued/analyzed on its own merit. There's really no need for the distractive attacks on you personally in order to disagree with you.

You are a woman. That is enough for me to know in order for me to feel that your voice deserves to be heard and added to whatever conversations take place that will affect the lives of women.

RainSong said...

All of those were typically sensitive and insightful comments, Bint. I really disliked the way you were treated it hurt me deeply both in terms of your treatment and what the process reveals about the actual values and pratices of that board. You disagreed and the personal attacks rained out of the woodwork. You see, you can be a woman and still evoke hatred on that board just by disagreeing and the personal attacks will quickly ensue no matter who you are. Our politics are different, but I'd be with you in a second because you were treated unjustly in a feminist sense. I love most of your arguments because they are sharp and acute although obviously we depart in places. There can be joy in parting on povs too.

You're also right, I am not truly comfortable here and it's certainly not because of you. There are central themes of these so-called radical feminists that I agree with. I feel very deeply that pornography and sex-work does harm women in many ways. But it is the job of radical feminists to offer cogent and incisive social analysis as to why that is without drama or apoplexy. Good feminists just lay out their analyses and say "let's look at this" and they do so with dignity, respect and often formality.

I am embarassed to say that I was a liberal feminist for more than twenty years. I really thought that feminism was about maximizing the freedom of women but in actuality, I've come to see that doesn't do much. Hugh Hefner wanted to maximize the freedom of women too. That isn't going to change this society in a way that liberates women. What led me to radicalize was when I heard feminists saying that pornography and prostituting women was OK. I really had to re-evaluate at that juncture. I thought about leaving feminist but what I also saw was that I'd been a feminist all my adult life and HOW can one leave feminism if it is a part of you?

In actuality, I hate to turn this this thread serious but in levity there are glimpses of truth. Could radical feminism be a powerful force changing the world? Yes, definitely. Do we need protection? I think again the answer is yes. If Heart opened up her boards, it would fill with MRA's and the shouting down would begin. BUT, remember years ago there was a human potential leader name Warner Erhart and it was learned that he was having sex with his daughter? Warner was at the top of closed society and he lost his grounding because there was no one to call him, mentor or ground him. I think the same has happened to Heart. How many people have you seen disagree with her and survive? Very few actually. The world does polarize against radical feminists. We are like lightening rods because we have the courage to say what we see needs to be said. It is not about all the drama, and situationality that characterizing Heart's board. By situationality I mean that depending on the situation there are very few constants in her positions. Once on the Ms board there was a lesbian only thread examining heteronormativity and was not open to Heart who had had her husband on the board. Nevertheless, she came into the thread and when she was called on it, "Her response was, "I'll go anywhere I want." That's our boundary loving, respectful lesbian with a husband, Heart.

But you knew that.... [smile]


One of the best threads you could possibly make would be to excerpt quotes of Heart exclusively and have her debate herself. It would be impossible to tell who won. She is a talented women and very bright but she has lost her grounding and retreated back to fundamentalism.

I would be scary to that crowd because I know what radical feminism and they would not like to look at where they depart from it.


I'd agree with about being able to share what one needs to, without personal attacks. BUT, I have to be attacked because I am radical and other than dismissal and declaration and personal attacks there isn't a lot of content there. There was in the past and it's a loss of a meaningful space.

I have defied the boundaries of the board. I think injustices need to be confronted.

annaham said...

"You wouldn’t believe the sleaze that gay men buy into either, so men do this to other men, not just women. Gay men engaged in consensual mass murder “the AIDS epidemic” and could care less about the results. Their entire urban culture have become one vulgar sexual scene."

*boggle*

I'm amazed that almost all of these "radical" feminists are so concerned about what's going on in other peoples' bedrooms and/or sex lives. There's nothing "radical" about appointing yourself the Sexual Morality Police.

Anonymous said...

"You wouldn’t believe the sleaze that gay men buy into either, so men do this to other men, not just women."

So? This doesn't alter the fact that they do it women.

It's pretty central to radical feminism that heterosexuality and S&M share something in common which is the eroticization of the power gendered power differentials between men and women. SM emulates these power differential in their skits.

AS far as i know sex is not important to radical feminists. HOW it is played out and the power relationships in sexuality is quite important simply because it's naive to think that what occurs in the bedroom stays there. Of course it doesn't.

Radical feminisms also rejects morality as a hegemony for controlling women.

Goodness, I wish there were people who undertood radical feminism to critque it. These criticism are pretty typical of SM praticioners I've seen.